Do modes exist in the harmonic / melodic minor scales?

Question

I'm trying to get my head around modes and the tonal center. In my understanding the natural minor scale is the same as the Aeolian mode. However, when considering the mix-up that happens in the harmonic and melodic minor scales, this led me to wonder. Do the modes bear any relation with these two minor scales? Like, if I'm playing Harmonic minor C scale with a tonal center of the D. Could that be considered Harmonic Dorian D?

Answer 1

Do modes exist in the harmonic / melodic minor scales?

If your definition of "mode" is "an inversion of a parent scale", the answer is YES.

All of the modes of the Ionian parent scale can be used as fodder for melodic soloing over one chord or another (chord-scale school of improvisation), however only five of them are commonly used as key centers: Ionian (Major), Aeolian (natural minor), Phrygian (Spanish minor), Dorian "minor", and the Mixolydian.

While the Lydian and Locrian are popular choices for melodic structures to play over certain chords (M7#11 and half-diminished 7 respectively), they are very rarely used as key centers.

In the case of the harmonic minor, the most common and popular mode is the one built off the 5th degree: The Phrygian Dominant. In many Spanish musics this is used as a "key center". The E(7) being the final tonic chord built off the first degree of that scale.

In the case of the Jazz minor (aka "Ascending Melodic Minor") there are a good number of useful modes to use as melodic devices over certain chords, but (with the exception of the parent scale), none of them are commonly used as key centers.

Notably the Lydian Dominant and Super-Locrian (both over dominant 7th chords depending the alterations).

1. Jazz Minor (Tonic)
2. Jazz Phrygian / Phrygian nat6 / Dorian b2
3. Lydian Augmented (over 7#5 chords)
4. Lydian Dominant (over dominant 7th chords, ex. 13#11)
5. Jazz Mixolydian / Mixolydian b6
6. Aeolian diminished / Aeolian b5 / Locrian nat2
7. Jazz Altered / Super-Locrian / Locrian b4 (over altered 7th chords)

https://www.amazon.com/Modalogy-Scales-Chords-Primordial-Building/dp/1458413977/

Answer 2

Modes and Scales are different things. With the rise of keyboard instruments and the shift towards scales, Western theory left most modal work behind. Modes function more as a "this is a set of rules and relationships" whereas scales work with an implied harmonic structure.

For example, some modes always start on a note other than the "starting pitch" that we think of. Some modes commonly use specific intervals in the melody. Also, initially they were just numbered! The names of the modes come from Greek modes (which were totally different) and so theorists went "those names are cool!" and just kinda... tacked them on there.

Scales are built off of tonal centers and strong lines leading to said centers. We can use modes like we use scales, but that's not how they were initially used.

That being said, looking at your example, you have a b2, b3, b5, b7. That is more friendly to Phrygian than anything else with that upper leading tone. But it might just be more "working in the minor mode" than anything specific.

I hope this helps! What an interesting question!

Answer 3

The Greek Modes should not be confused with other scale systems - they are a system unto themselves and don't exist within the harmonic and melodic scales. The easiest way to think of them is this: using only the white notes of the piano keyboard, starting from each one and playing each white note up to the octave repetition will give you the seven modes:C to C is the Ionian mode, D to D is the Dorian Mode, E to E is the Phrygian Mode, F to F is the Lydian Mode, G to G is the Mixolydian Mode, A to A is the Aeolian Mode, B to B is the Locrian Mode. You can create these modes starting from any note by using the same pattern of half and whole steps that occur when you follow what happens on the white notes. This will not work using a harmonic minor scale. So, to answer your question, you would not get a D dorian scale starting the on second step of a C harmonic minor because the second step of your D scale would be an Eb instead of an E natural as would be needed for a D dorian and the fifth step would be an Ab instead of the needed A natural. I hope this is helpful. Feel free to write back with questions if you have them. Stephen